Thread

I used RoR for a while, and then I got annoyed at how slow it runs. And each new version makes it run even slower…

It is nice though, especially Active Record.

When they speed Ruby up and speed RoR up, I’ll take another look. Though I’ve noticed that some influential Rubyists have already moved on from RoR to stuff like Merb…

i am sick with myself for even posting this message…

please, gberz3, just take a deep breath, relax, and explore the cavernous wonders of the CI site and stop being such a nudge on this thread.

thread referencing a recent benchmarking of various frameworks, including CI

We should all just be happy with the fact that so many, quality, web development frameworks are available for free these days.  It wasn’t that long ago when your choices were limited to Server-Side Includes or CGI/Gateway scripts in PERL or C.  Now that wasn’t much fun at all.  Forget about MVC frameworks, ActiveRecord, etc.  Just sending the results of a web form to yourself via email was a half-day job.  😊

I chose CI because it makes your manhood a little longer every time you use it. Bet you didn’t know that did you? Also, I heard that using Ruby makes your hair curl…

It’s true, on both counts.  And I used to be tone-deaf before CI.  Afterward?  Perfect pitch!

thread referencing a recent benchmarking of various frameworks, including CI

Thanks for that post sophistry.  That’s exactly the kind of information I’m looking for.  I noticed, however, that those are all PHP based frameworks.  Have you any info comparing various frameworks with different language foundations?

I’d love to be able to come up with some quality regressions of my own (at the very least Django, CI, and Rails) , but I won’t have a great deal of *consecutive* free time in the foreseeable future in which to do so.

I’ll check back with this thread every once in a while to see if any new “nuggets” if info are dropped.

Currently, I’m working my way through this thread:

Symfony, Django, and Rails

RoR doesn’t scale well. You can’t build sites that support millions of users and billions of page hits as easily as you can with PHP.

RoR is good for small hobby sites on your own server, just to say you did it.

Even Python is a better choice than Ruby…

RoR doesn’t scale well. You can’t build sites that support millions of users and billions of page hits as easily as you can with PHP.

RoR is good for small hobby sites on your own server, just to say you did it.

I have to disagree with you there.  RoR might not scale *easily* (depending on the technique(s) you employ), but it does scale remarkably *well* as far as performance is concerned.

Even Python is a better choice than Ruby…

I must agree that Python has some amazing abilities and does them faster (e.g. list comparisons).  I’ve noticed that Ruby seems to bog during certain complex comparisons; whereas PHP, and Python. . .not so much.  As a side note, this may be heavily platform related as well.  I’ve noticed a greater disparity between the performance on PPC vs x86.

RoR doesn’t scale well. You can’t build sites that support millions of users and billions of page hits as easily as you can with PHP.

RoR is good for small hobby sites on your own server, just to say you did it.

I have to disagree with you there.  RoR might not scale *easily* (depending on the technique(s) you employ), but it does scale remarkably *well* as far as performance is concerned.

Even Python is a better choice than Ruby…

I must agree that Python has some amazing abilities and does them faster (e.g. list comparisons).  I’ve noticed that Ruby seems to bog during certain complex comparisons; whereas PHP, and Python. . .not so much.  As a side note, this may be heavily platform related as well.  I’ve noticed a greater disparity between the performance on PPC vs x86.

What I meant was:
Sure you can build then, but you will need to spend $$$$ on extra servers and extra staff to keep the site operational. Where as if you went with PHP you could have saved yourself the $$$$ and headaches. 

In response to your Ruby issues, that is exactly why RoR is not the best choice for most projects. 😊

isn’t ruby, the zend frame work and codeigniter similar in that they all use the MVC pattern of logical expression
ruby has a view class and so does CI and so does the zend frame work.

there is more then one way to skin a cat

in the end, the only thing that is important is that the thing you build does what you want in the most efficiently way possible or the laziest way possible

The programming “features” are similar, but Ruby is not supported natively like PHP is, so it is harder to get a system configured to run Ruby. The other thing is, some “features” take up a significant more amount of system resources than they do in php, like active records. This system resource overhead makes RoR good for only smaller sites.

These are some links (*seemingly* less biased than most) regarding scalability of RoR.  The Twitter interview (although potentially debunked in other stories) seems to be the most objective;  as he’s admittedly a Rails fan, but shamelessly mentions its flaws.  Obviously take them all with a grain of salt:

http://www.tonyspencer.com/2006/11/26/ruby-on-rails-scalability-is-it-a-problem/
http://blog.viget.com/will-ruby-and-rails-scale/
http://theocacao.com/document.page/421
http://www.radicalbehavior.com/5-question-interview-with-twitter-developer-alex-payne/
http://www.slideshare.net/Georgio_1999/how-to-scale-v2/

. . .if you guys find any quality info regarding CI, Symfony, Cake, Django, etc. please post.  Thx.

David concedes that Rails can only handle half as many requests per second as PHP and therefore you are roughly going to have to spend $500 a month for 2.6 million requests/day on Rails versus $250 on PHP.

It’s only 1/2 as good ... but its so much better, *trust* me ... lol

David even had to rewrite parts of Campfire in C because it couldn’t handle the number of requests… I’ll stick to PHP - I know it works without having to dive off into some other language.

David concedes that Rails can only handle half as many requests per second as PHP and therefore you are roughly going to have to spend $500 a month for 2.6 million requests/day on Rails versus $250 on PHP.

It’s only 1/2 as good ... but its so much better, *trust* me ... lol

You’re right, but if you read that again, I believe his point was that the money you spend in server costs to scale it is more than saved in development costs.  Even over the life of the project.  As I said though, take it all with a grain of salt.

I’ll stick to PHP - I know it works without having to dive off into some other language.

Fair enough.  As a bit of F-my-I, what did you use *before* you came to PHP, and what about PHP made you decide to give it a try?