Thread

That is a harsh response. What you pay for is 1.6.7 right now and they continue to support it well. We don’t even have to know they’re working on 2.0.  The method of software releases they use is why brought a great product to such a large community…of paying customers.  It works well for them and the majority of their community.

I don’t think that’s a harsh response at all - I pay for a product regardless or the version as well as the future of a product - as a customer either I believe in a product and trust it incl. where the product is going in the future or I don’t - based on this I decide whether I want to pay the license fee or whether I should go with an opensource software - an answer like “we just don’t know when we release it” or whatever would be more customer - anyway, you have your opinion, I have mine - I have been working in the service industry for many years and this is just I would try to treat my customers.

So you’d rather an incomplete piece of software? As a previous poster has commented, you’ve never paid for EE2, you’ve only paid for the previous version.

You never pay for a future model of a car, only the one you buy from the show room.

I invest into the future of a piece of software - I don’t know any company that would buy a license of a software for just a year or so knowing that there will be no future - anyway, just saying it’s done when it’s done to paying customers of EE is harsh and not professional at all - even sorry, but we really don’t know yet or maybe within the next few months or so would be more friendly.

I invest into the future of a piece of software - I don’t know any company that would buy a license of a software for just a year or so knowing that there will be no future

I’m totally with you there. The fact is, though, that we have a very good, mature, powerful product out there right now. It’s called EE 1.6.7 and we will not abandon it anytime soon. Actually, EL has gone on record saying that it will be available for download even after EE 2 has been released, and we will continue to support it, and fix bugs.

In that sense, EE 2 will be an entirely new product. I can understand the excitement (I am excited, too!), but there’s no reason to hold off developing sites. As to release dates: We don’t give any, as a rule; it’s company policy that has served us well in the past. Consequently, there’s no release date, but a release process.

I invest into the future of a piece of software - I don’t know any company that would buy a license of a software for just a year or so knowing that there will be no future

I’m totally with you there. The fact is, though, that we have a very good, mature, powerful product out there right now. It’s called EE 1.6.7 and we will not abandon it anytime soon. Actually, EL has gone on record saying that it will be available for download even after EE 2 has been released, and we will continue to support it, and fix bugs.

In that sense, EE 2 will be an entirely new product. I can understand the excitement (I am, too!), but there’s no reason to hold off developing sites. As to release dates: We don’t give any, as a rule; it’s company policy that has served us well in the past. Consequently, there’s no release date, but a release process.

You got it - that’s the way to respond to paying customers!

Thanks for your understanding

I have been picketing out in front of their offices for a week now and they finally broke down and gave me a 2.0 t-shirt to just go away lol. 

All jokes aside the product must be very close or ready now or they would not have the dev release.  If it got released now to the mainstream I believe they are still cleaning things up and not ready for the onslaught of support questions about this plug-in does not work or my screen looks funny questions, in other words they want to make sure they can give you their undivided attention.  Even I have grown weary of waiting but let me add that when the 2.0 product comes out I’ll buy it play around but really not right away using it for production sites.  It may take 2 weeks or a month before I am ready to build a site with it.  I want to have the understanding of what add-ons are available and the new code structure.  Some add-ons may never work in 2.0, so everything may be slow going with converting existing sites.  Did they handle everything about the 2.0s launch correctly, I don’t think so but it’s my opinion. Overall I found them to be a really good company. The truth is I don’t know the vacation schedule or personal lives of the staff.  Maybe the main programmer came in drunk everyday for a week because they pushed him to hard, who knows. It seems to be behind schedule but all will be forgotten when it hits on opening day.

Even I have grown weary of waiting but let me add that when the 2.0 product comes out I’ll buy it play around but really not right away using it for production sites.  It may take 2 weeks or a month before I am ready to build a site with it.  I want to have the understanding of what add-ons are available and the new code structure.

I agree with that approach.  Although, I’m planning to build my personal site with EE 2.0 right out of the gate.  I’ve been meaning to work on my personal site and this is the perfect excuse to do so.

Maybe the main programmer came in drunk everyday for a week because they pushed him to hard, who knows.

Derek, is this true?  :D Or maybe it’s Rick….

Important, insightful points here…

 
All jokes aside the product must be very close or ready now or they would not have the dev release.

Which makes sense, of course. We just don’t know if we’re a month away, or three months away from a general release.

If it got released now to the mainstream I believe they are still cleaning things up and not ready for the onslaught of support questions about this plug-in does not work or my screen looks funny questions, in other words they want to make sure they can give you their undivided attention.

As much as I want to dive into all the delicious goodness that EE 2.0 promises, it’s best to make sure it works very, very well first. Any product that’s delayed this much has a lot of eyeballs on it.

Even I have grown weary of waiting but let me add that when the 2.0 product comes out I’ll buy it play around but really not right away using it for production sites.  It may take 2 weeks or a month before I am ready to build a site with it.

Amen. Ditto. Second that emotion. I’m on board immediately for try out phase, then, after awhile, I’ll upgrade a not-quite-so-important site, then, once it looks good all around, add ons included, I’ll roll out to other sites.

I want to have the understanding of what add-ons are available and the new code structure.  Some add-ons may never work in 2.0, so everything may be slow going with converting existing sites.

That’s so important. I keep most EE sites limited in 3rd party add ons, mostly because some don’t get as much attention from developers as they may need. I’m likely to start EE 2.0 on a site with no 3rd party add ons.

Did they handle everything about the 2.0s launch correctly, I don’t think so but it’s my opinion.

There’s probably a lot of agreement on this topic. EE 2.0 should never have had any publicly announced consideration of “summer 2008.” That’s too specific for such a large venture (while EE 2.0 may not be heavy in the new site building features, it’s heavy on user interface changes, and the move to CI was not trivial). Lesson learned, no?

Overall I found them to be a really good company.

And there’s more to this than the size of the sentence. If you’ve been around CMS apps for a few years, whether open source or commercial, you know something about EE’s approach to customer support. Considering the price of the product, show me a better supported CMS app. EE is a complicated product, and, unlike WP, Drupal, Joomla and crowd, has an extensible flexibility that is remarkable and complex. That requires knowledgeable support staff.

The truth is I don’t know the vacation schedule or personal lives of the staff.  Maybe the main programmer came in drunk everyday for a week because they pushed him to hard, who knows. It seems to be behind schedule but all will be forgotten when it hits on opening day.

If he needs to be drunk more often to produce more code, we could all chip in for appropriate liquid refreshment. Otherwise, I’ll save the beverages for EE’s coming out party.

Fully agree with mmjaeger. For months now you mouthwatering your existing and potential customers with talks/previews of Vers. 2 - yet no signs of when that beauty will be released. While that makes perfect sense for you as a company - to prevent customers to switch to other products - it does not make sense for your customers that paid to use your product. As a customer, I wish you would have never mentioned that your working on a major new release. That way I would have put my sites redesign not on hold for such a long time. But that’s my problem.

For months now you mouthwatering your existing and potential customers with talks/previews of Vers. 2 - yet no signs of when that beauty will be released.

Mouthwatering talks and previews? Really? I mean, there were some CP previews and such, and some basic info, but—and I say that as an employee, but still—I think there is remarkably little hype. Yes, we know it’s coming, but as Leslie said: it won’t be a surprise. There will be a beta phase, and you will know well in advance when EE 2 is going to be released. Currently it’s more of a no-nonsense, let’s cross this bridge when we reach it approach, avoiding all empty hype. I for one certainly appreciate that.

More importantly if it hadn’t been mentioned then people would just get on and use what is out there you can’t keep on waiting for something that you know is going to be out at some time just because you want to have it.

I see it akin to purchasing a computer. There is always going to be something better coming out just down the road but do you wait and wait and wait and never get anything done in the mean time? Not me. I get what will keep me going for as long as is possible (at least 3-4 years) before I’ll even think about upgrading anything.

If you have clients come to you with work in the mean time what do you tell them exactly? I’m waiting for something to come out before I can work on your site?

ExpressionEngine 1.6.7 is a true behemoth and runs many many different sites on the internet some of which are exceptionally large corporate sites so it can definitely do most everything you will need right now.

I for one wouldn’t wait just because something better is coming at some point. I would get on and take the clients money personally 😉

Best wishes,

Mark

Txs for your reply Ingmar. FYI: I am running my business on EE, and previously on pMachine. And all I know since one year is that there will be a new EE version with some great new community features. Excatly what my readers demand. So whenever I think EE, I think “new version.” That’s the message I received from you. So I am checking EE.com on a bi-monthly basis, hoping the new version is out now, so that I can sit down with my web-developer and implement it. I know, that’s my problem, not yours. I choose to wait, because I like your product. But responsible communication with your customers is your job. For my taste, your communication of Version 2 was misleading, in that it started way to early. I know, you never promised anything. But you raised expectations - at least with me - that are not met today.

For my taste, your communication of Version 2 was misleading, in that it started way to early. I know, you never promised anything. But you raised expectations - at least with me - that are not met today.

There’s some truth in all that, of course, but there’s also a requirement for a prudent and pragmatic approach to any release of new software, just as much as there’s a requirement to be prudent and pragmatic when using software to run a business.

Anyone who is waiting around for the ‘latest and greatest’ version before proceeding to build a site is not being wholly responsible, because current tools and features are anything but antiquated. On the other hand, a software vendor that pre-announces a new version with plenty of spiffy new features and then doesn’t deliver said version for a year or two isn’t benefiting themselves or their customers.

For EE customers who continue to complain about EE’s delay, give it a rest already. Nagging won’t make EE appear any sooner. Code doesn’t write itself.

For EE, hopefully a lesson has been learned about pre-releasing information so far in advance of an actual shipping date.

I, for one, appreciate EE’s recent posture regarding 2.0—a steady, somewhat innocuous stream of milestones. Looking back on the past couple of years it would appear that Rick and the EE crew have been busy what with Code Igniter development and a complete revamp of EE to match. Neither of those are mean feats, so maybe it’s best we cut them a little slack since they’ve obviously learned a lesson about pre-announcing future products. EE hasn’t changed for the worse in the nearly two years we’ve known about EE 2.0. EE 1.6.7 remains highly capable. EE support is as good as it gets in this price range.

I want EE 2.0, but I’d rather have it when it’s ready. It needs to be as solid and dependable as EE 1.6.7, and it needs plenty of new features (not just eye candy CP) to make it a worthy successor. I’m confident we’ll get both.

Wait—there’s going to be a 2.0?

No way. We would have heard.

<ducks and runs>