Thread

bkuberek is correct. Nobody outside of EllisLab has any version of 2.0 yet. When a beta is ready it will be announced on the EE Blog along with sign up info.

However, you’ve moved on to being cynical and argumentative, which is not welcome here. Its not professional. Take that somewhere else. Thanks.

with that being said, let’s please just call this over.

Yes, in terms of that, let’s call it over.

I do want to be clear that people are welcome to be critical, be upset about the delay, etc… That’s just fine and very understandable. Theos is right in that not everyone is happy or supportive. Though I doubt anyone is more upset then us really.

If someone is being critical of us, I’d ask the same thing from the long-time community members. Let them have their say, let them be critical, and voice their dissatisfaction.

We just ask that the conversation remain professional and constructive. Thanks.

If I may, I’m not so upset about the delay and I’m not rude. You can read my previous comments in this thread.
I was attacked personally several times just because I said that I’m not happy with the delay. Leslie called me unprofessional and bkuberek even asked about my age.
Well I’m not a kid my friend, I was born on 01/07/59 (European dates) and in fact I’m a professional, I run an architectural studio (I have a PhD in Architecture from Milan Polytechnic School) and a web agency since 1995 (yeah!).
If someone owns an apology this is not me.

And that’s my last word.

If I may, I’m not so upset about the delay and I’m not rude. You can read my previous comments in this thread.
I was attacked personally several times just because I said that I’m not happy with the delay. Leslie called me unprofessional and bkuberek even asked about my age.
Well I’m not a kid my friend, I was born on 01/07/59 (European dates) and in fact I’m a professional, I run an architectural studio (I have a PhD in Architecture from Milan Polytechnic School) and a web agency since 1995 (yeah!).
If someone owns an apology this is not me.

And that’s my last word.

If I misread your posts as argumentative and cynical when you did not intend to be, then my apologies to you. I meant no offense, I was just trying to keep things civil. I certainly did not mean to imply that you personally, are unprofessional.

Also, you’ll note I stuck up for you in my previous post. Now that we’ve cleared up your intent, let’s get this back on topic. Thanks.

I do apologize if I did attack with my words. I don’t want to do that and I do want to be friends with everyone here. I do also sometimes write without putting too much thought into it. I think we ought to be more careful with the words we use. Specially because the words are all we see. I don’t really know who you are neither I know what you’re thinking.

I asked your age not in a literal way but just to emphasize that the language you used was not very professional. I made the mistake myself to build on the quarreling.

I think we all owe you an apology. We do stand up for EE and we over reacted. But for future reference it will be good that we proof read what we say and make sure it is clear and focused before we post. The words we use can be interpreted in many ways if they are not well formed. I will do that myself.

Back on topic… I do have a question about 2.0

Will EE 2.0 have the ability to nest template groups within other template groups?

I’d like to have an extra level of organization in my templates and I wonder if this will be a feature.

Thanks

Will EE 2.0 have the ability to nest template groups within other template groups?

I’d like to have an extra level of organization in my templates and I wonder if this will be a feature.

Thanks

I’d second that request.
And I’d add a related request: EE needs a _supported_ clean “user-friendly” url set up that removes requirement for “index.php”  without requiring the unsupported use of mod_rewrite. IA folks will love you for this.

To add to the thread, I’d have to say I am disappointed in EE 2.0’s delay. And while I understand the issues and the reasoning, I’d say that the EE Team really needs to be aware that it’s competitive advantage will suffer if the release is delayed too long….

The CMS ecosystem is evolving ... Drupal now has Mark Boulton on Board helping to address its biggest drawback: design unfriendly theming…

time is ticking…

;>

(just in case you weren’t feeling enough pressure !!)

And I’d add a related request: EE needs a _supported_ clean “user-friendly” url set up that removes requirement for “index.php”  without requiring the unsupported use of mod_rewrite. IA folks will love you for this.

Just a note that there isn’t a way to rewriting index.php out without mod_rewrite (or the IIS equivalent on such servers).  These are server, not scripting, limitations.

I wouldn’t be surprised (or dismayed) if 2.0 comes during 1Q 09.

It appears from the outside that EE set an outrageously ambitious goal - nearly full backward compatibility with EE 1.6.4 while entirely rearchitecting and rewriting the entire engine over CI. Now, granted, CI itself was partly the fruit of lessons learned designing EE, but that is a far cry from EE having been the fruit of CI.

Imagine if OSX had run Classic not ‘under’ itself but within itself (as a first-class part of OSX), while the new OSX remained wholly focused on a non-Classic trajectory for the coming decade! Yikes.

Or if XP and VIsta had saddled themselves with the legacy of Windoze at their core instead of making the clean break that MIcrosoft achieved with such panache, just as Apple did with OSX. Oh. Erm. Never mind 😉.

My now ancient experience managing a large 4GL UNIX development team (stop laughing) says that there is (e.g., was, not is, I’m confident), a small but unavoidable risk of 2.0 failing altogether. Even in the best possible case, the EE team cannot possibly demonstrate to their own satisfaction that 2.0’s quality will meet their own high expectations. It’s somewhat unknowable in principle, given the project scope. And I’m talking at delivery time, not alpha or beta time. And all this aside from breaking, by necessity, the community’s fantasied expectations of CMS nirvana with real software that will force everyone backwards on the learning curve.

Considering EE’s track record, I’m sure 2.0 will be killer, even if it is rather fragile for a year or so. EE/CI? I mean, come on. Killer.

So, I’m a heck of a lot more worried about EE releasing early because I’m frustrated, than releasing late (even way late), but getting it right. Getting it wrong will not be fatal, but far more damaging than any number of delays. 1.64, with all its blemishes, is cool beans and will be for the next year versus its competition, absent any updates at all.

All this said, I’m not predicting 1Q 09. I’m expecting 4Q 08. But the date 2.0 is delivered is nearly insignificant, unless the revenue spigot on 1.64 sales and license upgrades dries up to near-zero. That would put entirely the wrong kind of pressure upon Ellis Labs ... but it is pressure to which any business has to respond, even at the price of taking nasty (additional) development risks.

When it comes to even a ‘timely’ release of 2.0, let’s remember we might regret getting what we wish for ...

Just a note that there isn’t a way to rewriting index.php out without mod_rewrite (or the IIS equivalent on such servers).  These are server, not scripting, limitations.

Thanks for the quick reply, Derek.

I _do_ understand that.

How about a standard/ preferred / supported methodology for this on say *nix builds of Apache 2.0.xx and better.
and add in an interface/hooks for making all the redirect/changes (logout, preview etc.) update correctly.

kind of an “ifIndexRemoved” flag/variable..

just a thought…

(should I run and hide now? is asking for this really so much like farting in church?)
<emphasis>smiles</emphasis>

We’re considering adding some tools to assist those on servers that support it to accomplish this in future versions, dreas, but probably not in time for 2.0.  For now, Leevi Graham has released a nice extension that will greatly assist you.

We’re considering adding some tools to assist those on servers that support it to accomplish this in future versions, dreas, but probably not in time for 2.0.

great to hear it’s on your list !

For now, Leevi Graham has released a nice extension that will greatly assist you.

excellent.. checking this out now…

(of course supported is preferable in long term )

I’d love to hear something about some new features that have been locked down.

For example, any new parameters, tags or variable pairs? Something for us to learn and read up on and be ready for in time for the launch instead of being hit all at once.

Perhaps even a quick trawl of the technical or how-to sections and see if EE 2.0 can now solve those problems out of the box?

All in good time though!

It appears from the outside that EE set an outrageously ambitious goal - nearly full backward compatibility with EE 1.6.4 while entirely rearchitecting and rewriting the entire engine over CI. ...

...there is a small but unavoidable risk of 2.0 failing altogether…

Adding to that I have to say that I care less about backward compatibility. I much rather write a migration script and have a sturdy brand new EE than have a CMS that is not to its full potential because it needs to be an easy upgrade. Also I would love if Ci ever went completely PHP5 and OOP.

I’ve dropped PHP4 quite a while ago and I advocate PHP5 be made a requirement.

There is a CodeIgniter like framework called kohana written fully in PHP5. kohana was derived from CI and rewritten in PHP5.

Why is it imperial to keep PHP4 compatibility if great majority of hosting providers have already migrated to PHP5?

Have anyone here heard of Propel? We have used Propel in conjunction with CI as our Object-Relational Mapping (ORM). Makes development so much simpler. What are the chances CI would implement Propel or a similar approach?

I’d love to hear something about some new features that have been locked down.

I have much to agree with that. I’d love to have a glimpse at the new features list. Even if we don’t get to see them work. At least we can start getting ready. As soon it is out we are getting dirty.

I’d love to hear something about some new features that have been locked down.

For example, any new parameters, tags or variable pairs? Something for us to learn and read up on and be ready for in time for the launch instead of being hit all at once.

Perhaps even a quick trawl of the technical or how-to sections and see if EE 2.0 can now solve those problems out of the box?

All in good time though!

I second this.