Thread

OK, I’m bumping this so that perhaps Sue and or Greg can get me some info…....

I spoke to my ISP, who I might mention is probably the smartest network lad I’ve ever had the pleasure of dealing with. Based on what I told him, he asked me to check with you about two things….

1. Can EE (1.6x) use the mysql memcache program - apparently this is a caching daemon which he indicated “hooks” must be built into the software if it is to function.
2. Where exactly does EE 1.6x store the user cookies on the server? He mentioned that this problem might be related to slow file reading of the cookies files due to server load - and that he might put this file onto a temp RAM disk of some sort….

Comments?

The other thing he mentioned is that I just may be running into the limits of the core software - it would be interesting to know if any (or many) people have a server running with the number of mysql calls that I have in EE - my heavy use of the Discussion Forum seems to generate vastly more calls than most blog or channel based sites…per page, and in total….because users tend to hit the forums hard and quickly. This is just wild speculation, of course, but it might be nice to compare my mysql stats against some other known norms….just to make sure I am operating within “the box”.....

I am moving the whole deal to a faster server in two or three weeks, but that is simply brute force and he indicated it would not make a big difference if the software (EE) was not tuned to use the faster server (I assume he means internally as well as use of the memcache, etc.)

Anyway, any hints or comments from gurus would be greatly welcomed!

Craig

Craig, it may also be time to get the upgrade for 2.x going.. especially since you’re going to a new server.

I’ll ask the dev team about the other questions.

I was going to do updates after moving to a new server - but then again, that would be a good question because I think I have read varying opinions about whether 2.x is faster or more stable in the discussion forum?

I am now getting lots more visitors reporting the error - even when the server is slow. It seems as if once they cannot post, they still cannot even when the server has a light load. That is strange! Also, I logged in as the user (from the control panel members thingy) and WAS able to post. So that becomes another question or hint. Am I effectively exactly the same as they are when I log in to their account through the control panel “log in as member” options in the members admin.

Someone must have a hint as to where this is occurring - the fact that it is persistent even when server has light load must point to something??

Try clearing caches and have them delete the cookie.

All that stuff was done early in the game - a couple folks cleared all cookies, all browser cache files, downloaded different browsers and even tried other computers in their household! I cleared the caches on the EE control panel many a time, moved the problem members from group to group, and optimized the db.

I am starting to think my first post contained some of the answer - that being, it is a function of “infinite numbers of monkeys” - and of multiple small problems adding up to a bigger problem for some…..

I think I have the server under control…by eliminating some fluff from the forum pages like visitor stats, one set of ads, etc.
I also changed the number of topics and posts on a page so less requests would be made to the server and lastly tried fussing with some settings in Apache and Mysql…also, traffic slows down for the holidays by a small amount - just enough to make things generally OK (hopefully).

Now, put on your tinfoil hats - for some strange occurrences and guesses and actual fixes…which tie into the infinite number of monkeys thing!

About 2 weeks ago, I got a new mac mini for my wife. Everything worked fine, except that whenever it tried to do the Software Update from Apple, it would download files, unpack them, start to install them and then say it could not be done since the files were corrupted!

Being the stubborn type, I tried again and again - tried downloading only one of the programs at a time (itunes, etc.)..through Software Update.
No luck.
Ok, so tried downloading the update direct from Apple using the Firefox browser…...no luck, corrupted when tried to install.
So I opened another browser, Safari, and downloaded the single itunes file from Apple - it worked…..

Still, none of the other files I downloaded for system update, etc. would work.

I did some looking around on google - and it seems like a pretty rare problem, but one person mentioned that they took their computer to a friends house and then everything worked…all the updates!

This got me thinking, so I hauled the mini to the basement and plugged it directly into the router next to my desktop. Lo and Behold - I got two more of the updates installed, but 2 were still giving me the corrupted notice….....

So, as a latch ditch effort I plugged the computer directly into the cable modem single ethernet port…..no home network, just direct to the cable company. Everything then worked….....

Why am I telling this story? Because I just got 2 out of the approx. 10 “problem” customers to fix their problems by plugging directly (or as close as possible) to their routers…and then totally resetting their routers! I have not yet contacted the others, but if two were able to fix it, it is likely that some of the problems relate to “stuck” settings of some type related to internal networks and routers.

The strange thing is that these people were able to do everything else, even other forums they belong to, while the EE didn’t work. I don’t blame that on EE - it certainly most likely ties into the total complexity of the internet these days. There are so many possibilities - a lot of people have aging routers - or not the newest firmware, etc. etc.

Add in all the various new and upgraded standards, core routers, ISP’s, hops, etc…..and it starts to amaze me that this thing (internet) works at all.

Anyway, there is the up-to-date report. I will post when and if I get some others to fix it using the direct plug method.

Meantime, Greg, could you or another support person find out about that memcache thing - whether EE 1. or even 2 has specific hooks into it. My Admin mentioned that software needs to know about it in order to take advantage of it.

Here, for example, is an article on using it with vbulletin:
http://www.howtoforge.com/using-memcached-with-your-vbulletin-forum-to-reduce-server-load-debian-etch

Let me know so at least I have something to look forward to with 2…....if not 1.x

Hi, Craig -

Whew, what a read!  It sounds like you’re getting to the bottom of it - some conflict with the networking and EE’s security.  Please let us know if the others are fixed by doing this.

Neither EE 1 nor EE 2 have built-in support for memcached at this time.

Not sure I will ever get to the bottom of it…but to add some more actions and hints…..

1. Two new users who were trying to sign up (did not have an account) received that same “not authorized to perform”, which is really strange! Never happened before.

2. Other users reporting it are all “medium” posters, that is they are not here every day….and often not every week. Time goes by and they come back to post…and they cannot.

I’m going to start asking them about connection type - I noticed two with DSL (verizon.net) emails, but need to get more info on the others to see if one type of connection is any worse than another.

Chances are I will never fix it. It will hopefully fix itself. My plan of action is to upgrade to the 1.7 within a few days - this will at least make certain a new version of most of the core files, etc. are in place.

Hopefully, I will not cause more problems by upgrading - but I will back up well beforehand.

I will then be moving the 1.7 then to a new server within a couple weeks to deal (hopefully) with speed issues, etc.
It was time to do that anyway, as I don’t trust machines going on 4 years old…...if my luck holds, things will fix themselves. If it does not, then I will rely on Lisa having a flash late one evening and saying “yes, craig, is is like 127,347 in the file gftys.juys.php, located in your foobar folder…just change the “2” to a “1” and everything will work as new.

Lisa has a great memory.. much better than mine. (She’s younger, too. 😊) Just let us know what else you find out.. We’ll be here.

I think the main issue here is resolved by:
1. upgrading to 1.7
2. manually deleting all the cache files via ftp

The second one was never suggested to me, but I found somewhere where Sue suggested it to another user…....

I have not had a complaint about that issue in the 10 days or so since….....just “normal” complaints (usually the fault of browser settings in IE, etc.).....

So, I have my fingers crossed that whatever Gremlin was causing the “not authorized” is flushed out!

The speed issue is not totally solved, but I have done a ton of research into the causes…...learned a lot! The conclusions are for another thread and another time - but it appears that most speed problems are not easily solvable with EE forums because the forum module was not 100% optimized for speed. It was built as a very functional module and written many years ago - changed relatively little in the time since. For now, I’m going to throw hardware at it and hope for the best….I think that will carry me through another year or so! As an example, Googles webmaster tools rate many areas of my site quite quick, even areas served by EE and custom mysql/php (which I wrote) come in at 1.5 to 2.5 second page load (over 1000 data points), while Forum pages tend to average closer to 6 seconds. It appears there is just too much code to parse…..that is, my web server and even mysql is quick enough, but the EE overhead is relatively high on the forums.

As to an upgrade to EE2, I have already purchased the upgrade, but cannot find a single post or thread which discusses whether this provides a efficiency boost - that is, if it benchmarks faster when it comes to the forums and to even the basics. If in fact anyone or the dev. team has benchmarked ANY improvements in EE2 and the Forums, I’d love to hear about them! I don’t like making upgrading decisions on faith alone…...
:lol:

Hi handyman,

Thanks for the detailed posts. Regarding upgrading to 2.x, I wouldn’t do that solely for a speed boost because the forum module in 2.x is still very similar to its 1.x counterpart.

I will leave this thread open in case you have additional findings. Hopefully your forum posts will be working smoothly for now.

Hi handyman,

Thanks for the detailed posts. Regarding upgrading to 2.x, I wouldn’t do that solely for a speed boost because the forum module in 2.x is still very similar to its 1.x counterpart.

I will leave this thread open in case you have additional findings. Hopefully your forum posts will be working smoothly for now.

Things are working smoothly - BUT, I would really like for a slightly more detailed explanation of your advice above.

I understand that the forums were not reworked in terms of feature set - but all the materials I have read have suggested that EE (and presumably the forums) were completely rewritten using the CI base.

Are you saying that the CI base, upon which the forums run, is not much more efficient in terms of everything from speed of actual output rendering (of page) and of communication with the DB, etc.?

Or, more clearly, that a benchmarking of EE and Forums would not show a major improvement using the newer versions along with newer (5.1+) mysql?

Although I am not a tech myself, I am pretty good at understanding the lingo, so feel free to respond at your highest possible level of geektalk (or straight talk) to explain. I’m one of those guys who always had to know “why” when I was a kid!

Happy Holidays!

Hi Craig,

I understand that the forums were not reworked in terms of feature set - but all the materials I have read have suggested that EE (and presumably the forums) were completely rewritten using the CI base.

That is correct.

Are you saying that the CI base, upon which the forums run, is not much more efficient in terms of everything from speed of actual output rendering (of page) and of communication with the DB, etc.?

Or, more clearly, that a benchmarking of EE and Forums would not show a major improvement using the newer versions along with newer (5.1+) mysql?

That I can’t say since much of that will be dependent upon your server and your setup. As Brandon said, the module itself is very similar in terms of features and function but it was rewritten to work within the CI framework.

Cheers

Greg