TappingLuau.com is a blog serving up a wealth of info, articles, and tap-alongs about the use of EFT (Emotional Freedom Techniques).

The site has been up for awhile, but owner/operator Oliva Brown wanted to actually have a bit of content there before making it “official”...

The site comprises 11 EE blogs that serve up the different sections.  It’s based on the butterfly template, and is hosted by pMachineHosting.

I recognized the butterfly template at first sight. I like this template. It’s clear and functional.
But frankly, from a webdesigner I would expect more tuning than you did.

Uh, I’m in business to make money so I can eat.  If the client is happy and doesn’t want to pay for more “tuning”, then no more tuning gets done.

In this case the client was on a limited budget, and wanted to put her cash into site functionality rather than trendy design.

I agree with qlas (up to a point) but sometimes fast is as much a part of the design brief as being original.
EE allows you to do just that: have a site up in very little time.

I’m the client, and I was very happy with what Mike did.  As he said, I was on a very, very limited budget and cared about a few certain features being original (which he implemented), but on the whole, I needed a specific functionality.  I wanted to spend my monies there rather on tweaking things to have a dramatically different look from a template that I really did enjoy.  Hey, if money was no object, I would have gone for it with gusto!

I think it’s a great example of what can be done on a small budget with a web developer implementing the entire blog.  Probably many of the people on this forum are technically inclined or enjoy taking the time to explore and discover the intricacies of EE—-I’m not one of them!  I loved that I could focus on getting my practice going while Mike was working halfway across the country building the blog to do what I needed it to do.

Boyink - 01 December 2005 01:16 PM

...If the client is happy and doesn’t want to pay for more “tuning”, then no more tuning gets done…

I agree fully with you Boyink and e-man. I didn’t intend to be offensive.
I was just commenting here on design and not on how fast and easily you can make clients happy. (No irony here.)
I’m myself a happy client and appreciate the free butterfly template. Good design doesn’t
have to be expensive.

Hi oliviabrown thank you for joining the discussion. Welcome to the happy clients club.
(You were posting while I was still typing on my last post.)

oliviabrown - 01 December 2005 03:22 PM

...I needed a specific functionality…

I have visited your website and haven’t figured out yet what this specific functionality was.
Maybe I’m blind. Anyone who could give me a hint?

qlas - 01 December 2005 01:09 PM

I recognized the butterfly template at first sight. I like this template. It’s clear and functional.
But frankly, from a web designer I would expect more tuning than you did.

I have to agree with him to a point as well, from a “web designer” I would have to expect more, I do understand that your “out” to make a living but you cant make a living without dying first.

If the client is happy and doesn’t want to pay for more “tuning”

Its not really about “what” the client is willing to pay its what the “designer” is willing to do, I know personally as a web engineer I {often} sacrifice a little knowing that a client will refer based on that fact and that they will also most likely be a returning client, if you show them you are dedicated to your job they are more then willing to return for more products . The number one thing complained about in this world is lack of dedication, lack of support and lack of willingness

Uh, I’m in business to make money so I can eat.

Again as an avid and dedicated engineer I have to say that was a very poor statement that makes all of us lifers look bad because that basically says wedon’t care about you the client I’m only out to make it for myself, as long as you are satisfied with the minimum then its all good, :( I spent my life dedicated to engineering for the web and to me my code is more important then weather or not I eat tonight, because i might starve tonight but ill have a feast tomorrow from that code probably

sometimes fast is as much a part of the design brief as being original

I agree to a sense, fast is what our industry is all about, http://www.jordonandrachel.com, http://www.inet-logic.com, http://www.yahoos-lamerz.com all those designs took me 1 day to design (not one day for all of them one day a piece), program, and test on all browsers that is not much time, all it takes is a bit of dedication and boom bangbam its done, its the love for the game that makes the drive, in this industry our cars are ran by determination, and the love for our jobs , thats exactly why before I even talk to the client I have a day long discussion with them where they fill out 3questionnaire’s telling me about exactly what they want and how they want it and then they talk to my artist who gets a feel for them and then we begin

Dont get me wrong, i am not cutting on him, I am just giving my point of view based on how I feel about my job and how much I love what I do, and some of the statements said here have been tapping at my nerves for a few days now so I decided to finally make my piece, he is good at what he does i will give him that.

I have one last comment, when you do all this do you give credit to the original programmer, because I know as a web engineer I would expect to have creditgiven to me in some way shape or form if you base your work off mine because I would have still created the work originally and it was my sweat and blood that went into all this as well.

I know I know I make things controversial but thats life, people often hate me over like me which shows my true geekness

The butterfly script is freely available to the EE community to use as we wish, even for commercial use.  If I am wrong on this please correct me.  This means there is no harm, and no foul.  No copyright laws were broken, and the clients trust was not violated. 

Expression Engine is a system that is written in a language that is made available to anyone free of charge.  This language is the product of thousands of hours of work performed at the hands of a passionate community which expects nothing in return.  This community allows, even encourages developers to create products from this language that can be sold for a profit.  Sprinkled throughout the EE source code you will find credits to ready-made code snippets (also freely available) that were written by other people.  The EE team is smart to leverage these open source offerings to bring us this great product.  It would be silly for Rick and Paul to otherwise.

This same idea can be extended to this situation.  This process of CSS/XHTML structure building, coding, testing, cross browser hacking, then more testing is a major component of web development, and it makes up a large portion of the final cost to the customer.  In this regard you could say browser bugs and slow adoption of good standards by the major vendors costs our clients money.  If you have a situation where you need to do more with less and and quickly, using an openly available template is a great solution.  The Butterfly template is very well tested and it’s simplicity allows for a wide range of applications.  In the case of this client, leveraging the work of others was the best solution.

Another point to consider is that web development is first and foremost a service.  On the one end that service might be a kid getting paid $20 to open a free account on Blogger to run a corporate blog with a default template (hey, I have seen it done and it served a purpose.)  On the other end might be that same business paying thousands for a much more complex project.  In both situations there is value in the time spent by the “developer.”  No matter what argument is presented, when I look at websites done by Boyink Interactive I see value in the design, expertise, and the time taken to put them together.  Personally I am happy to see such beautifully crafted web solutions aimed at the low budget client.  Too often you get just the opposite (low quality for a high price.)  Also keep in mind there is more than just a template, with the portfolio Boyink Interactive has put together, you are also undoubtedly getting great consultation from an experienced developer.

Good job Boyink Interactive, the EE community is better for having such a great designer in it’s presence.

Note:  I thought I posted this earlier today but I can’t find it.  The post probably did not go through, but I apologize if it showed up showed up elsewhere

Jordon, I appreciate your willingness to share your knowledge in the forums and you have a right to your opinion.  I do disagree with your post and I feel it is somewhat disrespectful to post such bold statements on the public forum thread for this launch.  I am somewhat troubled that you took such a stand when your own fee based design such closely resembles the design of the web standards awards site. 

Being among such great designers in the EE community (many of which hardly ever post here) is a humbling experience.  So much that I would even hesitate to call myself a web developer because I am certainly not at the level of expertise that is displayed here (actually I am a CompSci student and web dev is just a hobby for me.)  Before you position yourself as an authoritative voice on this subject, you might consider expanding your own porfolio.  Your criticisms might carry a little more weight if you were to have more than a handful of personal sites and a couple of EE templates to show us.

iNET-LOGIC - 02 December 2005 07:51 PM

If the client is happy and doesn’t want to pay for more “tuning”

Its not really about “what” the client is willing to pay

Yes it is. The client’s always right, and if they are on a budget, we try to accomodate that. I’m not a web designer, but in the service industry also, if you will. On the other hand, nobody expects me to work for free, not even my clients, believe it or not.

Uh, I’m in business to make money so I can eat.

I have to say that was a very poor statement that makes all of us lifers look bad

I don’t think so. It is a pragmatic approach, shared by many, and not only web designers at that. And, to make my point, certainly nothing to be belittled, even if you subscribe to a different school of thought.

Don’t get me wrong, i am not cutting on him

I’m sorry, that’s just how it comes across. He’s done a good job, from what I see, and if the front end / visual part “only” consist of adapting an existing template, because that’s all the client wants and needs, who are we to judge?

which shows my true geekness

You mean, being controversial equals geekdom? Well, you’re certainly entitled to your opinion.

manofsteel - 03 December 2005 02:48 AM

... I look at websites done by Boyink Interactive I see value in the design, expertise, and the time taken to put them together.  Personally I am happy to see such beautifully crafted web solutions aimed at the low budget client.  Too often you get just the opposite (low quality for a high price.) Also keep in mind there is more than just a template, with the portfolio Boyink Interactive has put together, you are also undoubtedly getting great consultation from an experienced developer…

I agree fully with you. I wasn’t commenting on Boyinks whole portfolio here.
In a whole I like his design, his homepage and more. He’s certainly a good
professional. As a client I would even consider working with him.

Ingmar - 03 December 2005 05:18 AM

iNET-LOGIC - 02 December 2005 07:51 PM

If the client is happy and doesn’t want to pay for more “tuning”

Its not really about “what” the client is willing to pay

Yes it is. The client’s always right, and if they are on a budget, we try to accomodate that.

Again I agree fully with you. But is this really the matter in this forum?

Maybe I was wrong to think that EE Sites presented here to the EE user community
should have something special, innovative, original in design or function and differ from known designs and templates.

Undoubtetly www.tappingluau.com differs from the standard Butterfly template to some degree. In that way TappingLuau.com is well posted in this forum. 

The only point I wanted to make is: Assuming that Butterfly is a well designed EE template and recognized as that by the EE community, the degree of innovation in design and function delivered in this special case doesn’t seem to me very high (mainly header picture und color changes - still waiting for hint on “special functions”).
I didn’t question client satisfaction nor professionalness of Boyink.

Maybe I’m completely wrong. Maybe the aim of the “EE Sites” forum is to give a place to introduce simply any new website based on EE? Please tell me.

Maybe I’m completely wrong. Maybe the aim of the “EE Sites” forum is to give a place to introduce simply any new website based on EE? Please tell me.

I don’t post all my new sites here.. but I do post some of them. It just depends on the site.

I’ll post to show how I used EE to aid in getting a site up and running quickly or more easily.

I’ll then try and mention any third party modules/plugins/custom code used to achieve the effect.

Having said that, this forum is just to introduce sites, whether they are using EE or using pMachine PRO.

It’s not meant to be “Best in Show” sites only.

Thanks Sue for your response.
That sounds reasonable to me.